Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

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Warren
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby Warren » Sun Jan 04, 2009 3:49 am

cozy171bh wrote:When I instructed, I had some students who because of lack of money or time took a year to earn a certificate or rating. I felt that the result was a pilot who was able to pass the checkride, but because of the drawn out nature of their training, they were not as proficient by the end of their training. My students who compressed their training into a few months became better pilots. As with all education, information is lost over time. The key, as in all flying, is to maintain proficiency.

I you don't mind me asking something a bit off topic. With your experience as a flight instructor, how often should a PPL student receive flight training? I've heard 2-3 times a week is best but I'm just wondering what you may know from experience.

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jackhodgson
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby jackhodgson » Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:37 am

Warren wrote:...how often should a PPL student receive flight training?


I'll be interested to hear what the CFIs have to say about this. But thinking back to my experience as a primary student...

I did most of my training on a 1-lesson-per-week cycle. I remember thinking that if money or time had allowed I would have liked to do two a week. But I don't think I would have gone to three a week. That would have been too much for me to absorb.

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Warren
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby Warren » Sun Jan 04, 2009 10:23 am

jackhodgson wrote:I remember thinking that if money or time had allowed I would have liked to do two a week.

That seems pretty reasonable. I'm probably going to begin training for my PPL in early-mid spring and right now I'm budgeting my money so I can get my ticket without any gaps in my training. Twice a week sounds good to me but I'd still like to hear from any CFIs out there :mrgreen: .

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champguy
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby champguy » Sun Jan 04, 2009 12:40 pm

Personaly, I think the ground school stuff would be best learned in an institutional setting. Class room, other students, a few older pilots in for refresher, discussion, etc.
Flying skills should be learned first in a light responsive trainer, one on one, two times a week more or less depending on season and weather. After some seasoning, an institutional setting might be best for learning to fly instruments and ATP. Want to wear a uniform, go to a mill where they grind off any rough edges, but please learn to fly first.
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cozy171bh
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby cozy171bh » Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:55 pm

I just had lunch with a local Designated Pilot Examiner here in Sacramento. He is qualified to give check rides for everything from Sport Pilot to ATP applicants in aircraft from LSAs to twins. His vote concerning accelerated pilot training programs is a definite "Nay". The check ride failure rate of applicants he has examined who come from an accelerated program is much greater than for those who go through traditional training. This examiner does not give away pilot certificates, but is more than fair to his applicants and works hard to calm their nerves and make them comfortable with him. His observation is that pilots from accelerated programs have poorer judgment skills than those who spend more time in a traditional training syllabus.

Also, on the Sport Pilot front, he reports that successful applicants have 30 or more hours of flight time (the regulations require a minimum of 20) by the time they are ready for the Sport Pilot check ride. This appears to be in keeping with the ratio for private certificates. Maybe Jeb has the data on this, but isn't the average number of hours for a new private applicant in the neighborhood of 60+ hours? I wonder what the average is for Sport Pilot applicants. Are they getting it done in 20? Where can one find this data?

hunter
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby hunter » Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:51 pm

Not sure where to get that data, but I got my PPL at 54 hours
As UCAP has taught me: "Time spent flying is not subtracted from your lifespan".

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champguy
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby champguy » Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:32 am

I think it's a matter of age. When you are young and indestructable, seeing the ground rushing up isn't a problem. After you have been over the handlebars of a motorcycle, and know how much it hurts, you tend to be more carefull. I had to learn not to flair high and drop it in, and to relax and let the plane stabilize and fly itself with just the gentlest of touches. It took some time.
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Dave Higdon
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby Dave Higdon » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:15 pm

My vote leans toward immersion, based on personal experience...can't address the institutional accelerated programs, though...

My primary CFI, Don, and I worked out a schedule to meet my schedule and my desire to go from start to finish in about a month...

So...flew twice daily for about 10 days, then three times daily for another 15 -- twice with my CFI, once alone logging hours hopping airports to get into crosswind conditions at some...practice, practice, practice...

My examiner was very complimentary about my ride and asked how long I'd been training..."about a month..."

He volunteered that the candidates he found did the best were the ones who finished inside five to six months...the ones that struggled most had spread their 60 or so hours across a year or better...and he felt that the immersion helped -- particularly if the pilot continued to fly weekly to bi-weekly after the checkride...

In my case, though, saved my bucks ahead of time and banked some vacation so I could take two weeks off to finish my ticket...

When time came to add the instrument rating, found another CFI/I similarly disposed to work out an immersion program with me one-on-one...finished that in 16 days -- but was close to sick of flying :o by the time I finished my checkride...a checkride that didn't feel as good as my PPL ride...but so it goes.

My vote: plan ahead, give yourself time to save some of the bucks you'll need, and then burn 'em up in a couple of months...ending with the ticket, of course...

FWIW...

Dave

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Soccer-Jock
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby Soccer-Jock » Thu Aug 20, 2009 6:52 am

So Hunter...
It's been many months now, and I believe you have your PPL. There will likely be other folks reading this at a later time with the same question you had.
Which method did you choose and what was your opinion of it?

hunter
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Re: Accelerated Programs, yay or nay?

Postby hunter » Sat Aug 22, 2009 11:19 am

Soccer-Jock wrote:So Hunter...
It's been many months now, and I believe you have your PPL. There will likely be other folks reading this at a later time with the same question you had.
Which method did you choose and what was your opinion of it?


Well I did not do accelerated for my PPL.

But for instrument, I am choosing the normal method/non-accelerated. The reason being not necessarily because I didnt think it was a good idea, but I am in my Senior year of high school playing sports so I dont have the time to commit to such a structured program without running into some major scheduling problems.

But in say the period of one summer off from school, I would most likely choose accelerated. I was just not home/not working for enough time, nor did I have the funds :D

All in all, I say it depends on personal preference and flexibility of the individual.

My two cents.
As UCAP has taught me: "Time spent flying is not subtracted from your lifespan".


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