Any traffic, please advise

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kellyrw
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Any traffic, please advise

Postby kellyrw » Thu Oct 15, 2009 1:43 pm

I'm looking for some input/suggestions for handling my biggest pet peeve in all GA, the oft-heard "Any traffic, please advise." Of course, the AIM states that the phrase "should not be used under any condition." We, as GA pilots, so often complain about how poorly the general public understands our avocation, but when a pilot cannot follow the rules, that really makes me steam. It seems obvious the two choices are to ignore the radio call or to respond. Ignoring the call would seem to increase the danger to everyone (and my mother's only son is always in my plane), while responding to the call just reinforces wrong behavior. So, what to do - ignore and then play "Hah, hah, I fooled you"; respond with a recitation of the AIM that the other pilot obviously doesn't much care about anyway; or have guns mounted on my 172 and solve the problem one errant pilot at a time. Just wondering how the rest of my little world responds to this issue. Thanks.

ruckin
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Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 11:42 am

Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby ruckin » Thu Oct 15, 2009 4:19 pm

I advise: Buy low sell high

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txpilot82
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Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby txpilot82 » Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:56 pm

hahaha... I like that ruckin! :lol:

I advise: Don't sleep where you work, don't work where you sleep.
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Dave Higdon
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Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby Dave Higdon » Fri Oct 16, 2009 11:19 am

Kelly, understand the frustration; heard the plea many times around uncontrolled fields and my reaction is similar...too often it generates several simultaneous calls, stepping all over each other so that no one understands any of the calls and the uncertainty and unsettled feelings only increase.

Now can't claim this is the be all and end all of approaches, but it's made me feel covered: Make your normal calls as you normally would, nothing more, nothing less.

When the "please advise" call comes across the airwaves, I do not respond to that particular call. Wherever my position is in relation to the airport, my calls come at my usual times, at what my CFI taught me were the appropriate times.

For me, that means starting to monitor the CTAF for the field at about 50; if there's traffic, I'll make a call at 40, saying how far and in which direction...another call at 20, another at 10, then 5...then when a mile away from entering the pattern, and from there on at the appropriate moments: when on the downwind, turning base, turning final, etc...

Gentleman asked me once why I didn't respond when he asked "any traffic please advise," and my response was that my pattern calls had been coming, regular, where and when appropriate, and if we all responded every time someone asked for an added response, we wouldn't be heard and maybe wouldn't be able to get in the appropriate calls...then, there was a question for him: did he not hear my calls...sort of ticked him off...yeah, he said, but wanted everybody to repeat 'cause he hadn't "really heard" what we said...stayed away from pointing out the error of his practice per the AIM...just the practical problems if everybody did it and everybody responded...

Never heard him make that call again...

FWIW...

Dave

kellyrw
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Location: KVIH

Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby kellyrw » Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:47 pm

Dave, Thanks for the response. Pretty much the way I've handled it, just fly the airplane and keep my eyes outside. It is interesting that the more egregious a pilot's error, the angrier they get when called on it.

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PilotBillFromTexas
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Location: KGPM Grand Prairie, Texas

Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby PilotBillFromTexas » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:38 am

I don't really consider "any traffic please advise" to be a huge error. It's usually some pompous basta*d wanting all of his subjects to report in. I usually give a position report because instead of giving a position report himself, he want you to do it. I don't know if this idiot is smoking towards the runway on a straight in or on an IFR back approach in broad daylight at 160 knots, who knows. I'm talking.

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joemurffy
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Location: Southwest Iowa

Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby joemurffy » Wed Nov 11, 2009 7:23 pm

Episodes and episodes ago this topic/phrase came up. I remember Jeb's response (because I was saying the same thing to the radio right before he said it, but I doubt you guys heard me) was that the only time it sorta makes sense is when you're on a straight-in instrument approach, and not yet under the layer (presumably low clouds, but not so low as to prevent pattern-work), and you get cleared to switch to the CTAF until relatively late. I typically monitor the CTAF while still with the controller handling my approach, but sometimes it is just too busy in the IFR environment. So, if you are going to say it, give something back to those listening. I would recommend something like, "Plattsmouth traffic, Cherokee 4362T, four miles north, straight-in on the GPS RWY 16 approach. Any traffic please advise." But if it is CAVU and I hear that phrase, I'm cringing with the rest of you.
Joe Murphy - KPMV

N4706E / N115CC "Circus, Circus"
'51 Aeronca Champ 7CCM / '79 Bellanca Super Viking
'Once you fly fabric, you won't settle for metal.'

Dave Higdon
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Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby Dave Higdon » Sun Nov 15, 2009 2:13 pm

Good stuff, Joe.,..and good idea for that situation...

Thanks!

Dave

LimaBravo
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Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby LimaBravo » Sat Dec 05, 2009 3:32 pm

joemurphy,

In your situation, if you were on an IFR flightplan flying the approach, when the VFR traffic in the pattern hear your announcement wouldn't they be obligated to give you the right away?

So IF it was a perfect world, you would not need the phrase "any traffic please advise" because the FAA has you covered with their rules at that point by giving you right of way over VFR traffic. (wink)

....unless, of coarse, you were VFR and just practicing. Then when ATC handed you over to unicom, you would need to find out who was in the pattern in a hurry somehow????

I was just curious about this, because I overheard an IFR guy "cutting off" a VFR guy last summer at "put in bay" (3W2) and this was the IFR guy's defense.... The IFR guy got handed off to unicom about 10 miles out and did not state "any traffic please advise". He just announced final about 3 times and flew the approach, subsequently jumping in front of the pattern (vfr) guy ??

~LB

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champguy
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Re: Any traffic, please advise

Postby champguy » Sat Dec 05, 2009 10:50 pm

And how does a hot shot coming in IFR from "away" get right of way over VFR traffic in the pattern. If the ceiling is over 1000 feet AGL, and the visibility above Class E minimums the field is VFR. No controler sitting in a bunker somewhere can just make the VFR traffic go away. The aproaching IFR pilot better get on the CTAF, take his turn, and deal with the traffic ahead of him.
If the field is below VFR minimums, then the VFR traffic needs to call ATC for a Special, and let them handle it.
Class G is a whole nother story, and you better have local knowledge.
Remember, not all who wander, are lost.
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